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FlyingsCool avatar image
FlyingsCool asked Barbs answered

Services and Living World Config for local airports only?

Are Airport Services and Living World Config files currently working such that they only apply to the airport they were written for?

I'm following the stated convention

AirportServices\<icao>\Services.xml or spb

and

LivingWorld_Config\<icao>_LWcfg.xml or spb

First - Does this limit their application to <icao> airport?

What about the Traffic section of the Living World Config file? Should I even bother to include it? Does it get ignored when it is <icao> specific? Which sections are honored as <icao> specific and which aren't. For those that aren't do they overwrite the defaults for the whole system?

Do these only get applied when I spawn at the airport in question, or are they applicable for the airport in question for all time, so, when I show up there, it access those files and applies them for when I start seeing traffic and parked aircraft?

All in all, how well,if at all, is <icao> specific Services and Living World Config working?

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Richie81 avatar image
Richie81 answered

Hi, I posted this on the other thread, and for some reason I missed your question when I posted days ago:

BTW, as a developer who have created livingworld files and distributed them in the community with payware product of AREX. You must understand that you can't configure for one or 2 airports. You will configure the ENTIRE region, so if you are doing KBED or KACK, you will configure thousands of airports, for example KJFK, KLAX, KORD, you name it all of them.

So presenty configuring for just one airport won't work, therefore you will configure the entire region.

So probably you are wasting your time considering your file will come into conflict with thousands of airports. And products such as ours will become incompatible with those users who have them. Have had these issues in the past months, have had developers remove them.

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FlyingsCool avatar image
FlyingsCool answered FlyingsCool edited

And I'll repeat my answer I wrote in the other thread here for other users who come across this thread:

Thank you for responding.

They describe two methods of creating LWC and AS files in the SDK, in one, you place them in shared, and it's supposed to affect the whole world. In the other you create an Airport Services file in

AirportServices\<icao>\Services.xml

and

LivingWorld_Config\<icao>_LWcfg.xml

But the SDK is unclear on what the difference is

1. Why have two methods of releasing files, if one isn't meant to affect only the airport it's designed for? Certainly method two implies it's only meant for the local airport it was written for?

2. The SDK seems to imply that the above method is local, and the shared method is meant to affect the world.

Quote from the SDK for Airport Services:

The Services.xml main file describes what services will be created at each airport (and mention the script files to use them), as well as the parameters controlling the position and frequency of creation of such services. A file in Shared will describe any airport that does not have a specific folder named after its ICAO code in any package.

Do you have it from an official source that local AS and LWC files can't be made?

Your experience with people's files interfering with yours may just be due to formatting issues and poorly written files by the other users? I've certainly seen lots of that.

That's why I asked the question in the other thread.

I'm sorry if my files are interfering with yours, but, I have to do something about firetrucks and other vehicles I would never see at the airports I fly into running around. I'm doing my best to do this in a non-destructive manner, so it's only in the airports I release, and would LOVE to have some OFFICIAL word on the intention of these files and how to accomplish what I want. The SDK is not clear on the subject.

And, btw, I agree with you, I don't want my AS & LWC files to affect everywhere. That's the last thing I want. But how?

Is it going to work appropriately some day, and but not yet?

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Richie81 avatar image
Richie81 answered Richie81 edited

Do you have it from an official source that local AS and LWC files can't be made?

I have had issues with other developers doing the same with other airports, it can be made, but the end user will bear the burden of the issues that will happen if this is done.

I'm sorry if my files are interfering with yours, but, I have to do something about firetrucks and other vehicles I would never see at the airports I fly into running around. I'm doing my best to do this in a non-destructive manner, so it's only in the airports I release, and would LOVE to have some OFFICIAL word on the intention of these files and how to accomplish what I want. The SDK is not clear on the subject.

And, btw, I agree with you, I don't want my AS & LWC files to affect everywhere. That's the last thing I want. But how?

Is it going to work appropriately some day, and but not yet?

If you are going to still do this, despite you knowing it will cause issues with thousands of airports, you need to let your customers/users know that, that despite you are doing 2 airports, thousands of airports in a continent will be affected. And most specifically tell them that your product is incompatible with AREX.

If you let them know that in your product page, I got no issue. I will point them to the fact that you have stated that before they bought it. And will make a thread on our forum stating that.

On the other official SDK forum from MSFS we spoke about this months ago, and the official word from ASOBO is that only doing living world for specific airports is not supported presently.

Initially when we started developing AREX it was with the intention of just modifying one airport, but we later found out that it will alter thousands. So it is presently an inconvenience, that we hope they can address in the future.

But as for now, this is not possible.

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FlyingsCool avatar image
FlyingsCool answered FlyingsCool edited

I will look for that thread.

I submitted a feature request for an optional tag in the <Airport> section of an LWC file like <Airport icao=xxxx>, and accompanying code to only activate that definition when the pilot is within 2 mi of the outer borders of that airport to allow developers and users to control airports at will without affecting other airports.

Oh, look! They said it's solved! ;) ...sigh

Having a single definition for a region is ridiculous.

In the meantime, perhaps you'd be interested in expanding the functionality of your AREX product to allow users to change the LWC configuration on the fly, so to speak?

I could imagine a few ways of doing this, from using a facility similar to addons linker to move different configuration files in and out, and you could supply several different types of files for various airport types and allow users to create their own if they so choose; to an interface to configure the LWC layout from a menu, turning available vehicles on and off, and controlling other aspects of the file through an "easy to use" interface.

I realize that this would have to be done before starting MSFS, especially now since they don't allow dynamic changes anymore.

I just realized that the removal of dynamic changing is probably due to Xbox DRM and won't be coming back....? sigh

P.S. I do enjoy your KBDL product. Thanks for choosing that airport as a subject. I'd get AREX, but I don't fly airliners. KBDL is a favorite airport I fly to to visit the New England Air Museum there.

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Richie81 avatar image
Richie81 answered

Thanks for your reply.

Actually AREX is more than working on the airliners. It changes the entire airport vehicle atmosphere. We replace them with custom ones, that look more region specific.

As allowing users to change LWC, we would have loved this, but AREX has in mind the MS marketplace user and that doesn't allow us to use external apps or functions to allow customers/users to modify. We do have an outside marketplace version that allows you to do that outside the sim, but in reality its quite confusing to have this and the marketplace customers not have it, so we just used this for North America and not use it for the other regions.

There is nothing we would love more for the SDK to allow us to just modify selected airports, and place the types of vehicles and liveries for certain airports. Right now, as we said its by region, make it almost impossible.

Sorry if I was a bit direct with your idea of modifying LWC files, the thing is we have had too many problems with developers doing that. Thankfully you have asked here and that I appreciate.

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FlyingsCool avatar image
FlyingsCool answered FlyingsCool commented

I didn't realize you had the functionality I requested in the North America version of your product. I'll look into that. I develop solely in New England.

That would give me an option for people who download my airports that I bet some would appreciate.

Yeah, it's kind of awful having Firetrucks and loaders and baggage cart trucks running around Turf airports where in reality you might sometimes find a beat up pickup truck driving around, and pilots and their cars, and that's about it. ;)

The work around is to have just a single parking spot, but, then you can't get AI parked aircraft, you can't congregate with friends at a local airport, etc..

4 comments
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I made a ticket about that via ZenDesk already... but as all other Reports it gets to SOLVED without any feedback....
1 Like 1 ·

"but as all other Reports it gets to SOLVED without any feedback...."

Yeah... It would be nice if Zendesk changed their terminology. Rather than "Solved" they could call it "Yep, somebody read it and did something with it. Sorry, we don't know what they did, unfortunately. Good luck! Hopefully they do something about it someday and it didn't just end up in the trash!"

1 Like 1 ·
I strongly agree. This actually matters, because as users we don't know if our specific case has been taken into account when there are many similar, but not exactly the same, bugs. Humans are reading the bug reports and they may make errors categorizing bug reports in their internal systems if they don't read the reports very carefully.


I have reports marked as solved from a half year ago, but the issues are still in game. I as a user can't know if Asobo think they've solved it or if it's still sorted as an active issue.

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Richie81 avatar image
Richie81 answered

Sorry for the confusion, I meant functionality to allow airline livery change. Not the way LWC files work, nor the function you requested.

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virtuali avatar image
virtuali answered virtuali commented

Just to clarify a bit, we discussed this in the old (now archived) Developers forum, I don't know if you had access to it but, here's the link:

https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/living-world-customized-airport-traffic/313001/4

If you cannot access it, the gist of it is that Asobo suggested we could have custom region definition, like "MyCompany_customRegion01" and have the airport reference that region so, you could both have localized LW vehicles for a single airport, but also have more than one airport using the same set of vehicles.

I opened that thread in November 2020, the idea of custom region came in March 2021, let's hope somebody is still looking at it.

2 comments
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Thanks, but, no I don't/didn't have access to that forum, and, unfortunately, I can't read that particular post. But, thanks for the tip. Did they describe the code for creating a custom region?

Also, I'd be perfectly happy if I could just create an LWC for each airport. I don't need to use them across multiple airports, especially if my files would override or be overridden by other LWC's anywhere else in the installation.

It would be nice, but, that would be a bonus if they let me use a custom region across multiple airports within a region while not affecting other LWC's from other authors, or, have mine be affected by somebody else's.


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 Did they describe the code for creating a custom region?

It was just an idea, the SDK doesn't support that at this time.

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Barbs avatar image
Barbs answered

If this isn't already wishlisted it ought to be.

Just the ability to change the spawn rates of the Living World models at a local airport would be good. As it stands I have aircraft spawning on gates 80% of that time that IRL would be empty 80% of the time.

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