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daScooty avatar image
daScooty asked daScooty edited

[BUG] Removal of Trees question - extremely hard to reproduce problem

Hi guys!

First of all, i am NOT a developer, so please have mercy on me, if the following may seem a bit awkward-ish presented.

I am just a sim user on pc, trying to find some possible solutions, to forward them to the developer of an addon and to maybe help him to solve a strange "phenomenon" i have.

It´s all about my home airport LOAV, located in the eastern part of Austria.

I´m sometimes getting trees placed in the middle of the runway and also nearby.
The problem is, this happens "sometimes" to me, but seems not to happen to other people using the same scenery.

As i tested a lot, i also had these trees placed at the same locations in the vanilla default scenery for LOAV. So i started to think, it´s not a problem with the scenery itself but with this region in general.

When i deactivate photogrametry and activate it again, these mis-placed trees are gone.

What makes it even harder to re-create this problem is, that i have a very special configuration, i am flying with. I use a streaming service named "Shadow", they have serverfarms in Germany near Frankfurt, in France near Paris and in the Netherlands near Amsterdam. I am hosted in the Frankfurt region. I am connected from my home location in Austria to the serverfarm in Germany.

I think, it is a problem on the server-side, that these trees are being streamed to my rig in some misplaced coordinates or so. Whenever this problem occurs, those trees seem to be the very same on the very same location.

So something out there in the world seems to believe, those trees MUST be placed there... which is wrong. But others, who are using the sim from completely different locations are getting different routes or server-hops, when they are connected, not getting those mis-placed trees it seems.

So it´s hard to search for a fix for people, who actually can´t see the problem on their monitors.

For an better reference, some screenshots from different camera positions:


https://ibb.co/G0vd8GR

https://ibb.co/crfX3tR

https://ibb.co/pR5TcG5

a-kopie.jpg
b-kopie.jpg

c-kopie.jpg

I have rolling cache and manual cache deactivated.
When these trees appear, i found out that deactivating photogrametry and activating it again seems to remove those trees, as long as the sim keeps running.

When i shut down the sim, reboot my rig, start the sim again, it´s very much possible, i got the trees again.

Is there anything, that can be done, to suppress those trees "hard coded", no matter what the servers wanna stream to this position?

It´s no matter, if some trees are misplaced in the scenery... but exactly there on and nearby the runway is a really terrible thing to have.

Reporting via a support ticket does not seem promising to me, as this special phenomenon is probably very hard to recreate. So testing, if it´s fixed, maybe needs to be done via my rig...

Any hints or ideas would be extremely welcome.
I´d collect them all and forward them to the developer, who understands things much better than me.
I´m just trying to support him to maybe solve this issue.

Thanks for listening and hoping for a successful bug-hunt.
;-)


Edit: to be sure, i´m NOT in the SU10 beta, i´m just in the released version ,also have done a complete uninstall and fresh install of the sim. I have also tested without any other addons except my LOAV addon. Those trees are coming back over and over again.

It maybe needs some "Digital Napalm" to teach those trees a lesson?
;-)

scenerybughelp
a-kopie.jpg (363.6 KiB)
b-kopie.jpg (329.8 KiB)
c-kopie.jpg (360.5 KiB)
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Photosbykev avatar image
Photosbykev answered Photosbykev edited

Here you go, digital napalm applied. LOAV Tree Fix

The trees are there if you go into scenery editing mode so I've just put some polygons around the trees to remove most of them. Drop the folder into your community folder and you should be fine, The link is hosted on my own googledrive.

Just shout if you want anything else tweaked

The trees problem is very very common in MSFS so I wouldn't overthink it too much, it's just the way it is lol

Kev

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daScooty avatar image
daScooty answered Photosbykev commented

Hey Kev,

first of all: thanks a lot for your help!

These evil trees... they are at the edge to drive me totally crazy soon...

I use AddonLinker to manage my sim. I activated your Digital Napalm and did a first test flight. The trees where still there, as if they where laughing at me.

I reset my grafics settings for the sim, deleted my rolling cache to be sure - it was deactivated anyway - i deleted anything from my \Appdata\Local\Packages\Microsoftblablabla\LocalCache folder and renamed the folder of your Addon to start with "zzzzz_".

(is renaming it a good idea?)


I rebooted my rig and did a couple of test flights from LOAV. So far, all seems to be nice and chilled.


'I Love the Smell of Napalm in the Morning", if you know what i mean...
;-)

I don´t wanna start my celebration too soon, as i had this some time before already, when it looked like as if the "Voodoo" had been sorted out, but then came back again.

I´ll keep this updated here, to report back, how things are going for me and my "tree-buddies".

Thanks a lot for letting me know, that there definitely ARE trees on the runway of LOAV. I really had thought, that it would be some insane special thing, that only happens on my rig.

So if you can see them too, i´ll call back my psychiatrist to let him know, my upcoming sessions with him are all canceled .
:-)

Just to undertstand, what you have created in the Napalm Addon, could you please explain a bit, what it was?

I assume, it was something about an exclusion? Was it a polygon or a rectangle? What exact exclusion did you use? Anything else to note about it?

Not that i would understand too much about it yet, but i´d like to inform the dev of the mentioned scenery, how you managed to solve this issue, if the trees are fixed and stay disabled.

If it´s not too much to ask, could you please also create something alike for the runways of LOXZ?

I was allowed to beta test a very nice addon from the same dev and had a small amount of vegetation at the beginning of the runway once. So i thought, my rig would be completely mad, but i am pretty sure, it´s the same issue than with LOAV.

I seem to be "blessed" to still get vegetation in front of my nose at very creative places. The exclusion polygons, built into the LOAV addon already with highest priority (as i was told), did not seem to fix it for me properly. Maybe it works better with your solution. I will have to reboot and launch the sim pretty often to see, what happens and if it stays nice and tree-less.

Thanks again for your help, i have the hope to get this "Voodoo" banned finally.

... to be continued, as soon as i have more news ...



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I didn't realise you were using a scenery mod for the airport so yes making my mod load last by renaming the folder made it load on top of anything else.


I just added polygons with vegetation set to zero scale and density over the tree covered areas, a very simple fix.

I'm away in the motorhome until early next week but I'll put a mod together for the other airport as well.


Kev


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daScooty avatar image
daScooty answered daScooty edited

Hey, no worries, sitting in front of a motorhome is pretty sure much more fun than sitting in front of a Monitor, busting evil trees...
;-)

I wanted to report back about the actual status.

It might be wishful thinking, but it seems to me, your addon suppresses those trees a bit more effective than the - probably same - exclusion pologons and rectangles, that have been integrated in the scenery.

But it still happens, that the trees come back, laughing in my face with their evil, dirty smile...

The mentioned scenery addon for LOAV (sorry, if i did not mention this good enough) seems to have it´s runway built by many, many different texture patches, that are overlapping with transparencies, to finally create the needed "worn" look, the real world runway has.

Somehow it seems to me, my rig occasionally isn´t able to arrange all those layers for the runway in the proper arrangement, resulting in some geometric effects and edges. I also think, therefore those exclusion polygons may get interpreted in some lower layer, resulting in vegetation being displayed.


Again, i´m not a dev, i have more of a photoshop and image editing background, where we also would build up larger structures by lots of "blended" elements. So it´s all just some theory, but the endresult looks like that to me.

Is this a standard, that runways are built in addons with many different elements? I think there are some different runway textures available in the dev tools. Is there anything, that could be done by a scenery developer, to "simplify" a runway of such a construction, maybe into a single 2-dimensional image instead of layers over layers over layers... ?

Maybe this could help my rig to have an easier time with this scenery?


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