Hello, i have to use a Aircraft from Prosim737 ( [prosim-ar.com](//prosim-
ar.com) ), a B737-800NG, for my Homecockpit. But the Developers are not able
to get the combination for the Nose Wheel and Tiller to work in the right way.
So, correctly you have on Ground full rudder deflection, but with the Rudder
Pedals only 7° delection right/left. But with the Tiller you have a deflection
of 78° on Ground and when using the Tiller, the Rudder is not deflecting, so
only the Nose Wheel is used by the Tiller. Is there any special requirenment
for the Aircraft to get it working or is there any Pararmeter in any of the
cfg-files or something ? Any Help would be really nice Matthias
For the FBW 320Nx we had to do a hack to make this work because you cannot
separate rudder from nose steering. At least it was impossible a year ago.
Maybe it’s time to have this possible directly from sdk.
Hello, ok cool, and what exactly did you do ? Matthias
Hi again, can you maybe explain by my mail?
mroschk@gmail.com Thanks a lot, its important for
me. Matthias
We substract the rudder input that the sim wants to add to steering so the net
result is only the steering we want. Without doing this you can turn the wheel
using the steering set axis but you cannot move rudder without it impacting
nose steering. Unless there’s a way to disconnect rudder to nose steering I
never found.
You can just have the tiller use the ‘STEERING_SET’ K event to set the
steering when the tiller is in use. This will not move the rudder and only
steer. This way your steering cfg can be set for the amount of steering when
using the pedals. So use the set event when the tiller is not zero or less
than 5 degrees.
SDK
Not equal to zero.
(L:Tiller_Position, Bool) 0 != if{ (L:Tiller_Position, Bool) (>K:STEERING_SET) }
+5 or -5 or greater
(L:Tiller_Position, Bool) abs 5 <= if{ (L:Tiller_Position, Bool) (>K:STEERING_SET) }
(L:Tiller_Position, Bool) would be the Lvar value for when you move the wheel.
So have some logic to set the value of steering you need. -16383 is full left
and 16383 is full right.
@mroschk interesting that we try to do things by our self because “some”
developers are not willing to listen to us. 
Best regards Jacob W
@Crocket Hi! Have you done any thing to “dampen” the speed at witch the nose
wheel can rotate? Best regards Jacob W
Yes, the Developers of Prosim are a bit … ahm, dont want to write this
here…btw…you know the Price of Prosim ?? If i could, i would change to
Airbus and use your airplane, but my Homecockpit is ready for a B737-800… I
also think the Developer of the Prosim Airplane has not much knowledge,
because the flying Behavior has not so much to do with the real Airplane.
Another Problem with Prosim is this: As of the Prosim Rules you must set up
all Axis in Prosim, not in MSFS and not in FSUIPC. The Problem here is, if you
do not set the Axis in Prosim and try to set up the Axis as Example in FSUIPC,
then Prosim always overwrite any Input from any other side ( like FSUIPC or
MSFS directly ). That means, if i set up the Rudder in FSUIPC and not in
Prosim, ten moving the Pedals to right or left, then Prosim always overwrites
this input and set the Rudder back to zero. Thats really annoying at all. But
i still have one question: I think i understand how you did it for the Tiller,
but as of the Devs of Prosim, they say MSFS is also turning the Nose Wheel
when you set the Rudder Axis, which should not be the case. I am not sure if
they are right or not, so how you did it exactly for the Takeoff Roll ? Then
you should ( using the Rudder Pedals ) still have the 7° left/right for the
Nose Wheel, but full deflection for the Rudder. How did you manage this ?
Brgds and thanks a lot for sharing that info Matthias
"I think i understand how you did it for the Tiller, but as of the Devs of
Prosim, they say MSFS is also turning the Nose Wheel when you set the Rudder
Axis, which should not be the case. " Yes and that’s why we have to use a hack
so the steering can be driven realistically. We’d just need a way to tell MSFS
to stop turning the steering AT ALL and let us do everything through steering
set event. For now I don’t think there’s such a possibility
Hello, Ok, and there is the 100mill question what did you exactly do ?
(“hack”) Matthias
”I also think the Developer of the Prosim Airplane has not much knowledge,
because the flying Behavior has not so much to do with the real Airplane.”
Well in that case PMDG is also not god. Don’t Ask me how I know. And I think
it is. I think the flightmodel is quite close to Level-D and that say alot. I
think that developer is doing a quiet good jobb and a lot of testing must have
gone in to the flight model. It is the attitude and willingness to listen to
feedback that is the problem, and that they don’t believe what you say. Look
at me I hade to go to a several hundred million dollar Level-D simulator to
prove that I am right, and all these 15 years I was right about how the plane
should behave. Most of the things I reported have bin fixed. But that they did
not listen is the frustrating part. Now I try to fix things my self with the
help of those that know these things better than me. Now to the point: You
have to differentiate between input from joystick controller>prosim
output>flight model And how the plane behave with those inputs, and what the
3D model is showing is a hole other thing, and a separate discussion. “So,
correctly you have on Ground full rudder deflection, but with the Rudder
Pedals only 7° delection right/left. But with the Tiller you have a deflection
of 78° on Ground and when using the Tiller, the Rudder is not deflecting, so
only the Nose Wheel is used by the Tiller.” I don’t know exactly what you mean
by “So, correctly you have on ground” If it is a question or a statement, but
basically with full ruder pedal deflection on ground the rudder should move to
end position and yeas the nose wheel should move 7 degrees bothe ways, if and
only if ther is pressure in the hydraulic system, that pressure prosim
simulates, and with no pressure ther should be very little movment and very
hard to move. This should be software simulated if they want a realistic
simulation not just a switch in instructor station. Also without hydraulic
pressure the nose wheel should not be moving at all not in 3D model not even
if you have engines running on the runway and move the plan forward. It should
go straight ahead. A question: What do you thing will happen if the pilots
make ruder check when taxing, do you think the plane will go to the right and
left 7 degrees then? Accord to one pilot friend tiller will override the
rudder, I don’t understand how that will work fully yet. But I will dig in to
that. “But with the Tiller you have a deflection of 78° on Ground and when
using the Tiller, the Rudder is not deflecting, so only the Nose Wheel is used
by the Tiller.” I don’t know why you say “but”, but maybe it is a language
barrier. You are absolutely right, and now bothe FBW and I believe the latest
beta of prosim uses the new “nose wheel axis” in MSFS, and can have separate
ruder axis. Of course as every serious aircraft developer there should also
have the ability to steer the plane with out a tiller, just like FBW, Fenix,
PMDG and Zibomod. In al those aircraft’s there is an option to use separate
nos wheel axis, on Zibomod you can even select which axis you want to be
coupled to nose wheel. In X-Plane the nose wheel can even move when the plane
is not moving. That is not possible I think in MSFS, som old legacy stuff. The
plane have to be moving for the nose gear to move. Maybe this is what you
meant from the beginning. In that case I don’t think it is possible to fix
this at the moment in MSFS. Then some heavy programming outside of MSFS is
needed, and custom 3d animation. If that would be possible at least one
aircraft should have that implemented. I also unfortunately think that some
parts of the prosim team actively don’t want to understand some users. Because
understanding means that they have to work, and I think that they have enough
on their plate. But you would think that flight control should just work after
12+ years bothe input output and what is shown on the 3d model.
What is more important in my opinion is how the plane behaves with those
inputs.
" mroschk
répondu • il
y a 3 heures
Hello,
Ok, and there is the 100mill question what did you exactly do ? (“hack”)
"
The exact hack is this: ( 1 . - steering_ratio_converted ) + (
rudder_position - 0.5 ) This is what we send as a steering_set axis to msfs.
So we demand what we exactly want (steering_ratio) minus what we know MSFS
will add behind our back (rudder_position). Sadly there are small drawbacks
like what we substract is not exactly aligned to what is really added by msfs
on next frame. So on FBW when you click on the “disable steering” button on
the tiller, you sadly still get some small ghost nose inputs from MSFS. I’d
love to just tell MSFS to stop turning that damn nose from rudder inputs…
I guess you didn’t add that to any cfg file? But how does that work? You have
2 assignments? Ruder axis, Nose wheel axis You assign them in fs, with means
you can not manipulate them much? In prosims case they are an external program
witch mean they can deside what will be sent and how much will be sent to
MSFS. All axis should be assigned in prosim. So technically they should be
able to artificially send a motion to a 3d part, let’s say the rudder, with
out sending any actual rudder input to the flightmodel. Same with tiller.
Rudder has now effect over a particular speed. Then you could make the rudder
have no affect under that speed. It could only moves a 3d part on the
aircraft. It is an ugly solution. But a solution. But basically MSFS should
improve this system?
This is done in wasm called on each frame. We effectively send all inputs we
want to the sim by catching normal Msfs keybinds and axis. Only issue is when
the sim hardcode some things behind the scene, like rudder affecting steering.
You have to find hacks…
@Crocket Is it possible to send private messages in some way to you. I would
like to ask alot about ground stering in general. Best regards Jacob Wiqvist
Wher exactly do you pu these lines of code? Regards Jacob!
Hello, thanks for the Answer. You send this directly via Simconnect i think. I
tried something like this via FSUIPC, but it seams not to work, so i will try
Simconnect directly. But the Code you send is a bit out of context but if
i understand correctly, you send the Rudder Value and then the Steering Value
to MSFS? The other Problem…as mentioned above…i dont know exactly what
Prosim is doing in the Background 
… really annoying. But yes, MSFS
shlould not “combine” the Rudder with the Nose Gear…thats even annoying. Why
could we not have the both Axis really seperated from each other or a Option
to switch that seperating ON/OFF?? I open a Ticket to MSFS SUpport on that,
but just after sending the Ticket it is marked as “Solved” and i never get a
Answer. I dont understand that Ticket System at all??? Matthias